Ouch Podcast #69 – May 2011
bbc.co.uk/ouch/podcast

Presented by Rob Crossan and Kiruna Stamell 

rob	Thanks for downloading us. In a change to the advertised podcast I'm Rob Crossan and this is Kiruna Stamell... 	
kiruna	Hello!	
rob	... with you for the next couple of shows. So when was the last time you presented on Ouch Kiruna? 	
kiruna	Oh it was a while ago, I remember I had my head in a bucket I was a bit crook that day, but feeling great today. And more importantly on today's show we'll be catching up with Liz Main who has a whole host of surprising mental health news. And later Rob? 	
ROB	Well later you're in for a real treat, we have two presenters from Shut Up and Listen - an amazing radio show hosted by people with learning difficulties in Brighton. 	
kiruna	Oh I'm looking forward to talking to the Deep Doctor. Intriguing - stay tuned there's lots of other chat beside.
[Jingle: From the BBC in London it's the Ouch Talk Show.]
Did you notice what I had for lunch today Rob?	
rob	You had half of a chocolate muffin it was something that's made you minty fresh anyway. 	
kiruna	It was, it was. I was being careful what I had for lunch today because I didn't want anything overtly smelly because I've got a hot date tonight. I just had to bring that in. So yeah I was eating with idea of kind of making out later. 	
rob	I'm noticing the flushed cheeks. 	
kiruna	A bit of a glow about me?	
rob	In your face, facial cheeks. 	
kiruna	Yeah. 	
rob	So come on tell me a little bit about it then. 	
kiruna	Well... 	
rob	Who's the lucky...?	
kiruna	I've just met somebody and it's really early days so it's undefined, but it's brought up some disability stuff for me. 	
rob	Why are you bringing this up on a disability show? 	
KIRUNA	Well because on our first date when we were out together I got yelled at from a car on our very, very first date.	
rob	Were they yelling at you or him?	
KIRUNA	They were yelling at me. They'd wound down the car window and then as they drove past they said... and it's a pretty immature insult and I've heard much better and much worse but still it's a first date so you're feeling a bit self conscious. 	
rob	Go on out with it, out with it. 	
KIRUNA	They said, "Grow up." 	
rob	Huh.	
KIRUNA	I know. 	
rob	And was he your knight in shining armour did he run after this car?	
KIRUNA	No neither of us are terminators. 	
rob	Protecting your honour. 	
KIRUNA	We're not going to chase the car down and ((0:02:06.9?)) in the back. No but it was interesting because it's so early in sort of the beginning of just some fun, and to kind of have your disability so publicly critiqued when you're out with this guy and trying to look really hot and really impress... 	
rob	And to clarify this for listeners we should point out that the reason why these people shouted grow up is... 	
KIRUNA	Is because I'm three feet tall. If only I'd known up was the right direction, I totally confused the longitudinal and latitudinal things on the map, that's where I went wrong. 	
rob	So you publicly humiliated on the first date. I presume it was all uphill from there? 	
KIRUNA	It was great actually. And what was wonderful was that in the moment we just let it go and later on in the evening he brought it up and asked me how I felt about it. But it was... 	
rob	Well how did you feel about it? 	
KIRUNA	It's interesting because I think when that sort of thing happens I sometimes feel very socially isolated like I won't feel bad about myself, like I don't sit there going, "Gee, Kiruna, you're so short and that's horrible." But when people are rude it makes me... because there are so many people out there who are willing to be open about their rudeness and that makes me a bit sad. 	
rob	Do you not think it was probably more the case that it probably bothered you far more than it bothered him? 	
KIRUNA	I don't know if that's true. I think that because for him that kind of thing would have been a first. 	
rob	I think he already knew what he was buying into. He knew he was going out on a date with a short person...	
KIRUNA	Yeah that's true.	
rob	... so having that kind of confirmed by a group of idiots... 	
KIRUNA	... but the social is not... 	
rob	... is not so radical is it? 	
KIRUNA	No but the social stigma that comes with it I think sometimes adds unfortunately like a bag of rocks to something before you've even got rolling. Like most people don't they sort of run into issues into a relationship like a bit further down the track when cancer or something happened... 	
rob	Cancer! 	
KIRUNA	I'm just saying. 	
rob	That usually happens after what the first four hours or what? 	
KIRUNA	No but let's say you introduce cancer on the first date. 	
rob	Cancer! Why would you introduce cancer on the first date?	
KIRUNA	It's a metaphor, Rob.	
rob	It's not a metaphor. 	
KIRUNA	I'm being metaphorical. Cancer was a metaphor for a challenge. 	
rob	I'm so glad I'm not going out on a date with you, it would be an intense night out wouldn't it? I'll go out on a date with you I don't want to talk about cancer. 	
KIRUNA	Are you asking me out, Rob?	
rob	Well you're already taken aren't you? 	
KIRUNA	Well I wouldn't say it's exclusive at this point. 	
rob	Oh I see okay. Well maybe we can... 	
KIRUNA	There's always a door that you could slightly leave open. 	
rob	Okay, I'll unhinge it a little but let's not go there. 	
KIRUNA	What I'm saying is that I think for people with disabilities particularly if the disability is visible, is there, and it does get addressed immediately. And it was quite striking I guess that on the very first date there it is kind of pointed out to everybody, but not just the fact that obviously I'm different, you're right he has noticed that, but the fact that comes with a certain social prejudice. And to have to deal with that in a situation where you're already nervous and you're trying to be the hottie that you are.	
rob	Yeah you want to be on top form don't you? 	
KIRUNA	Yeah. 	
rob	You don't really need that. Well did you consider it a blow to the ego or just a kind of minor... I mean how regularly do these kind of insults occur? 	
KIRUNA	Well it's going to happen and I think that because my disability is so noticeable I do get a lot of that kind of attention. 	
rob	Do you get it like every day? 	
KIRUNA	Yeah. 	
rob	Literally every day?	
KIRUNA	Yeah. I mean you wouldn't understand because you look relatively normal unless somebody interacts with you. 	
rob	Gee thanks, you say the nicest things. And how often do you bite back or have you just got to the point now where you just can't be bothered? 	
KIRUNA	It depends. I think if I'm in an enclosed space and it's really come into my space I'll address it. If it's somebody whizzing past in a car like I said I'm not going to run them down. 	
rob	You could try. 	
KIRUNA	You've got to pick your battles. And at some point it will happen again and so in a way it's just kind of dealing with the inevitable. But having to deal with it right up front and right at the beginning is... it's just a bit of a shock. 	
rob	Well you do kind of think well screw you I don't want to address this right now. 	
KIRUNA	I don't go on a million dates either I'm not kind of going out dating every Tom, Dick and Harry. So being interested in somebody's a bit special because not everybody is open minded. I know that that discrimination that leads me to being yelled at or stigmatised on the street actually also ties in with the fact that I've had fewer opportunities to develop relationships with men because people are scared of things that are different. And I'm aware of it when I walk into a pub that blokes are making inappropriate comments about me. So enough about me, Rob, get the focus off me. You, tell me what is the crack with you? Oh that's what I want to know has your disability ever kind of caused a problem on a date. Like have you ever not noticed your date, for example? And, and while we're at it, what's wrong with you because yours isn't obvious. They all know out there what's wrong with me but what's up with you? 	
rob	Okay. I'm an albino, as regular listeners to the show will know, which means I'm visually impaired and also in the last year or so I got diagnosed with Asperger's Syndrome as well. So I have two glorious disabilities - one physical and one mental. 	
KIRUNA	Can I just say you're looking a bit red today actually, I know it's been sunny while I've been in London. 	
rob	I've been in Copenhagen and I forgot to bring any sun block. But Copenhagen's amazing everybody looks like an albino, they're all really pale, a bit burnt, very blond hair - I've never felt like I fitted in so well as in Scandinavia. 	
kiruna	That's amazing. 	
rob	It was lovely.	
KIRUNA	You just disappeared into the crowd. 	
rob	It was total albino camouflage it's amazing, an amazing city. And what a gene pool, what a gene pool can I just say everyone's beautiful, no ugly people.  	
KIRUNA	You see there's nowhere I can go where I blend in. 	
rob	What about on the set of the Wizard of Oz?	
KIRUNA	Ooh nice segway except that it's not this show. 	
rob	Oh damn right, sorry we'll talk about that one in the next show. We can't talk about that one yet can we?	
KIRUNA	So back to you... 	
rob	Yeah back to me. 	
KIRUNA	... because you keep bringing it back to me and although I am the centre of my universe I want to know a bit more about you and dating. So come on, Rob, what's the story have you ever not noticed a girlfriend?	
rob	It's been... well the thing I usually do is I have this terrible thing where I hate being early on a date and I can't just order a drink and sit down because I just feel just incredibly uncomfortable so I'll go inside, have a look, see if they're there and if they're not there I'll literally go for a walk round the block for a little while. But this has also meant that all the time because I didn't see them the girl has been there and I've still gone for the walk around the block and end up being offensively late.	
KIRUNA	It sounds like you're trying to park a car. I'll just go round again. 	
rob	Yeah it is. I hate it. I can't go into pubs on my own, I cannot do it... 	
KIRUNA	What about coffee shops? 	
rob	... if my friends aren't there or the date isn't there... nothing coffee I can't do it. 	
KIRUNA	So you'd rather be walking on your own? 	
rob	I honestly think that's why I started smoking so I could actually stand outside and have a cigarette and not look so insanely uncomfortable because at least if you're having a cigarette I can pretend that I'm doing something, not useful, but at least something. 	
KIRUNA	Have you not just thought you could pretend to be on the mobile? 	
rob	That's the loser's dream ticket. Everyone does that don't they and especially... 	
KIRUNA	No you're right. Smoking is so much cooler. 	
rob	Thank you I'm so glad, somebody who submits to my world view. But I've seen it before, well not me because my eyesight's too bad, but I've had friends who have said yeah I saw a bloke who was quite clearly waiting for a date who wasn't going to show up and he pretends he's on the phone, look a bit closer and you can see he's playing brick breaker on his Blackberry. Or he's just deleting old texts. 	
KIRUNA	Your friends can't know that. Anyone could be sitting on their own for any reason. Not every man on his own is waiting for a date that's not showed. 	
rob	There's a certain hunch shoulder tenseness. You drink your pint a little too quickly. 	
KIRUNA	Although...	
rob	You know when you can spot it in a pub when someone's on a date.	
KIRUNA	Hold on a second I think I've just worked this out. This is not about you going into a pub on your own, this is you deferring your anxiety about potentially being stood up by a date that never shows. 	
rob	Pop psychology but you're pretty much on the money. 	
KIRUNA	That is that's totally what this is about. This is not, "Ooh people are going to think I'm having a coffee. People are going to think I've been stood up" and that freaks you out.	
rob	What on earth makes you think that a woman would not turn up on a date with me? Look at this face. 	
KIRUNA	I don't think that... 	
rob	Look at this face. 	
kIRUNA	... but what makes you think that I think that? 	
rob	Well nothing at all I'm just playing devil's advocate. 	
KIRUNA	How would you rate your self esteem out of a level of one to ten? 	
rob	Can I turn it up to eleven? 
[Jingle: You can subscribe for free to the Ouch Talk Show by going to bbc.co.uk/podcast where you'll find us listed under entertainment. That's bbc.co.uk/podcast.]	
KIRUNA	Still to come on the Ouch Talk Show we have the guys from Shut Up and Listen, an innovative and anarchic radio show for people with learning disabilities. But now we're joined by Liz Main for a spot of news. Hello Liz.	
liz	Hi, how are you? 	
rob	Hello. Now, Liz, you work in mental health and communications... 	
liz	I do. 	
rob	... and you are bipolar yourself? 	
liz	That's right. 	
rob	Okay. Now you've got a few stories for us here. Now the first one I want to talk about is your incredible, well it's increadibly rubbish, frankly I'm not sure about the validity of this at all, you're more likely to develop eating disorders if you were born in springtime. 	
KIRUNA	Is that true?	
rob	Please try and... 	
liz	That's what they say.	
rob	... convince me of this. 	
liz	Well it's in the British Journal of Psychiatry this month so it must be true. The research does indicate it and bizarrely it ties in with other research in the past about people being born in winter and spring developing schizophrenia.  	
rob	So hang on we've covered three of the seasons then, so what about autumn?	
liz	Apparently brilliant to be born in Autumn. 	
rob	All the well adjusted people are born in Autumn. 	
KIRUNA	I'm an Autumn baby. 	
rob	Good. Well I'm glad we've got that sorted out. So hang on what does that make me, does that make me schizophrenic, no it doesn't it makes me more likely to have an eating disorder. Well I do like scotch eggs.	
KIRUNA	I'm going to wind Rob in there, sorry, sorry Liz. Back to spring time and eating disorders what was it that you found? 	
liz	Well people who are born then become more vulnerable and there is some sort of... That study didn't actually draw any conclusions but looking at other studies around the world, there's some indication that it's all about vitamin D in pregnancy. 	
rob	So it's about sunshine essentially. Exposure to sunshine.	
liz	Well yes sunshine but the suggestion that people should take vitamin D supplements. Now I would never suggest that anybody take anything because I have no idea whether that's a good idea or not. 	
rob	You've nicely prevented any litigation against yourself there, Liz, well done. 	
liz	Exactly. 	
rob	So what this means is that basically if you conceive in summertime they're going to be pregnant throughout the winter and then at the end of the nine months... 	
KIRUNA	And get little sunlight. 	
rob	... it's spring you get very little sunlight and therefore your baby's going to have... what's the connection between lack of sunlight and an eating disorder though? 	
liz	Well it's more about what happens to the baby's development I think in pregnancy. But what I really liked was this Queensland study, now Queensland being possibly one of the sunniest places... 	
KIRUNA	The sunshine state. 	
liz	God's own country seven sunshine hours a day in winter.	
rob	Oh stop sucking up to Kiruna. 	
liz	I'm Australian. 	
KIRUNA	That's alright I love the... 	
rob	Oh you two just get on with it then. 	
KIRUNA	Look would you just leave... 	
rob	Have you ever been to Hull? 	
KIRUNA	... leave us, Rob, to our nepotism.  	
rob	Okay, you get on with it then. 	
KIRUNA	You were saying, Liz. 	
liz	This comes to you from Qantas. Queensland... I wish. 	
rob	Other airlines are available. 	
LIZ	The University of Queensland found that boys who had a low vitamin D level were more likely to develop schizophrenia, but the same didn't apply to girls. 	
KIRUNA	Oh that's interesting. 	
liz	It is, they didn't explain why but it's absolutely fascinating. 	
KIRUNA	So there's a gender link in there as well. 	
liz	Potentially. I mean often boys do get schizophrenia more frequently than girls and it comes on differently but maybe it is sunshine hours. Maybe it's just boys who are prone to schizophrenia don't go outside when they're young and sit inside and don't go to the beach. 	
rob	But if it was really about exposure to sunshine wouldn't Australia have the most well adjusted people on earth?	
KIRUNA	Well I think we do. 	
LIZ	You would think!	
KIRUNA	So moving on. 	
liz	I’m evidence that we don't. 	
rob	I don't know about this I'm very, very sceptical. 	
liz	Well you know if you look at the eating disorders these Oxford scientists who did the research said that Karen Carpenter, Alanis Morrisette and Victoria Beckham were all born in spring. 	
KIRUNA	Oh well there you go. 	
rob	I didn't know Alanis Morrisette had an eating disorder. 	
KIRUNA	Yeah well listen to her lyrics, she's got something going on. 	
rob	She's got a talent disorder. 	
liz	I think Alanis Morrisette is talented but I have no evidence beyond the Oxford researchers that she or Victoria Beckham have an eating disorder. I think with Karen Carpenter it's fairly clear cut. 	
KIRUNA	Heat magazine OK and all of the other ones available on the shelf will have something to say about that weekly with photographic evidence. 	
rob	Yeah it's like the British Journal of Psychiatry just cheaper. 	
KIRUNA	And infallible with pictures. 	
liz	Yes I was going to say with pictures. 	
rob	Yeah more pictures. Our second story, I've got to say you didn't convince me at all there, Liz, in fact you almost seemed to talk yourself out of the argument by saying there's no proof whatsoever, didn't you say that at some point? 	
KIRUNA	I disagree.	
liz	I said there may be no proof whatsoever but I also... 	
rob	That's good enough for me. Right drugs in drinking water, let's talk about this. 	
liz	Yeah. This absolutely fascinated me. There have been a few stories about it this month. There have been a couple of bits of research on lithium which is probably the oldest magic pill for bipolar. Horrible I took it but it works fantastically for some people. 	
rob 	But it didn't work for you at all? 	
liz	Well it worked I just didn't like it very much. 	
rob	What happens that makes you... are there side effects?	
liz	It makes you fat and bloated and a bit sluggish. 	
rob	Oh I see, right, okay. 	
liz	But lots of people like it because it's natural, it's a compound that's found in drinking water. 	
KIRUNA	Cyanide's natural as well.  	
liz	It's in vegetables. Yes. 	
KIRUNA	But we're not putting cyanide in the water but people are talking about putting lithium is it in drinking water? 	
liz	Well the potential for it because where lithium occurs naturally in drinking water there seems to be a correlation between lithium and lower suicide rates. And the latest studies from Austria, and that backed up a Japanese study a few years ago, although I did a little more research on this and found out there's another article this month that there's no correlation in the east of England. So obviously the lithium effect doesn't overcome the misery in the east of England.	
rob	The misery of living in Norfolk. 	
KIRUNA	So there's the reality of one's environment. 	
liz	When they did the study in Austria they took out all the variants for being Roman Catholic and the proximity of psychiatry services so I'm not sure how the two were exactly linked and they found that those didn't factor in it was just the lithium and the water that seemed to factor in. 	
KIRUNA	Okay. Is there anything else that people are proposing we put in our water or anything that's in there at the moment? 	
liz	Well I don't think anybody's proposing we put it in there. 	
KIRUNA	Oh okay I made that link. I just naturally decided we should start drugging the population. 	
liz	No, no, no we're drugging ourselves... 	
rob	I'd love that if we could actually what if that was the referendum, never mind AV should we put rum in drinking water?	
KIRUNA	Well I'd like to put contraceptives in drinking water. Like I said over lunch when I was thinking that people should really have to apply for the antidote, we just drug them up and then if people want to function then they have to submit a letter to the government outlining what they'd like to achieve and they get the anti drugs.  	
liz	Sounds perfectly rational to me. 	
rob	Exactly. No it's sensible policies for a happier Britain. And what about... 	
liz	And we could get rid of sex education in schools entirely. 	
KIRUNA	We wouldn't need to worry about it. 	
rob	It scarcely exists anyway. All I got was my teacher putting a condom on a banana and you had to figure the rest of it out.	
KIRUNA	And all we'd need to do now is say, "Drink your seven glasses of water a day." 	
rob	Take your seven contraceptive tablets a day, even if you're a man. 	
liz	And you'll be happy and you won't have children. 	
KIRUNA	And you won't ask any questions. 	
rob	So hang on a minute. There's Prozac in water in some places. 	
liz	There is. 	
rob	Tell me a little bit about this. 	
liz	And that does not occur naturally unlike the lithium that does not occur naturally in water that is because we are peeing it out. We are taking so much Prozac in this nation that we actually excreting it into our drinking water. 	
rob	Really? 	
liz	Yeah. 	
rob	So we're basically we're having second hand antidepressants... 	
liZ	Yeah.	
rob	... every time we have a drink of water. 	
KIRUNA	I've always been a strong recycler. 	
liz	They did some great research. 	
rob	I don't know I mean I know David Cameron's always going on about big society and making Britain happier and all this happiness research, but I don't see it, quite frankly. In fact London looks more miserable than ever... 	
KIRUNA	Well you don't know that it's going on. 	
rob	... what I can tell at the moment. 	
KIRUNA	I mean who knows what's in the Thames. You know a couple of years we had a whale...	
rob	Well mostly Prozac and lithium by the sounds of it. 	
KIRUNA	Now we've got, yeah, Prozac and lithium. 	
rob	So basically the next time I drink a glass of lovely CO2 I'm actually ingesting some lithium and Prozac. 	
KIRUNA	You mean H2O not CO2.	
liz	H2O I think. 	
rob	Sorry yes. You can tell I failed science at school can't you. 	
liz	I don't know if you're breathing in the Prozac. But there's a great little story about prawns who are exposed to the same levels of Prozac that's in…….	
rob	Happy prawns. 	
liz	They were they got high. Prawns usually hang out in dark hiding places but they became five times more likely to swim up towards the light. 	
rob	And started opening discos. 	
liz	And thereby placing them at increased risk of being eaten by predators. 	
rob	Oh no so their happiness actually turned out to the end of them that's their death wish. 	
KIRUNA	They're the kind of prawns I want to throw on the bar-b I want to know that my meat and seafood has had a nice time. 	
rob	Has had a happy life yes. 	
KIRUNA	I want happier cows. What can we put in the grass?	
rob	Crack. 	
liz	It's probably already there. 	
KIRUNA	It might already be there. 	
rob	Who knows? Well you let me down on the first story but the second one I'm completely convinced. I see no reason whatsoever why we shouldn't be living in a kind of blisstopia as long as we drink more water. That's why the government want us to drink seven glasses of water a day because if we do that... 	
liz	Absolutely. 	
rob	... we're all going to end up in basically some kind of ecstasy fuddled nirvana. 	
KIRUNA	It's already got fluoride in it so most of us have better teeth because of that. 	
rob	That doesn't make me ecstatic. Not like Prozac, it doesn't give me the same buzz. 	
KIRUNA	I don't know. I really like a good set of teeth. 	
rob	Do you. Is that a turn on for you? You must have a terrible time in Britain then. We're the home of bad teeth. 	
KIRUNA	I've made a concession it's fine, it's fine. 	
rob	You're alright with mono-toothed ruffians. Well thank you very much for those stories, Liz, I must say because I normally do the news when Mat and Liz are here, and you've utterly shamed me with the brilliance of those stories. 	
KIRUNA	Oh they're such good stories. 	
rob	I actually can't... you know, I've got a big Nalgene bottle full of water here and I'm going to take a big glug now, so the next link's going to be even more delightful. 	
KIRUNA	Cheers, Liz. 	
liz	Thank you. See yer. Bye.
[Jingle: Want to find more disability related podcasts from the BBC try the You and Yours podcast, In Touch and All in the Mind. Go to bbc.co.uk/podcast where you can also find the Ouch Talk Show. That's bbc.co.uk/podcast.]
[Jingle: Boogie hard on the radio. Shut up and listen.]	
KIRUNA	That's a jingle from, as you've just heard, the Shut Up and Listen radio show created by people with learning difficulties in Brighton. With us in the studio we have two of its presenters, Ryan O'Donovan and Jacob Fitter and they're accompanied by Sam Eden-Green. Thanks guys for coming in. 	
Ryan, jacob and sam	Thanks for having us. 	
KIRUNA	Hello. It's great to have you here. Ryan, what is Shut Up and Listen. 	
Ryan	Shut Up and Listen is a localised radio show that's broadcast within the Brighton area and on Radio Reverb as a whole. And it's primarily to promote music from learning disabled artists, any learning disabled artist in the world who wants to be heard on the radio they can send in their music to us and then we play it. And it also features other entertainment segments like news updates on the bands or any learning disabled clubs or events which they might play at. 	
rob	And are there a lot of learning disability bands?	
ryan	Yeah there's... 	
rob	You're swamped with tapes and CDs and whatever coming in. 	
ryan	Yeah yeah we are. There's more even than we realised. I was just absolutely gobsmacked to find out how many there actually were. 	
KIRUNA	But that's not the only thing that you guys do, I mean I know that Jacob you've got the Deep Doctor, for example, tell me a little bit about that?	
jacob	Yeah that was just a small character thing I did. It came up because I had an idea for the radio that mainly on comedy because I'm not really into music. I do like music but, to be honest, I'm not a very nice person so they put me in the comedy section. 	
KIRUNA	Where the comedian belongs. 	
jacob	Yeah. 	
KIRUNA	Actually we've got a clip of some of your work, so we'll just play that for everybody now. 
[Playing clip: Dear Doctor
Dear Doctor
The Deep Doctor
Here with me right now is the local agony aunt.
The Deep Doctor. 
I am the Deep Doctor and I will be taking your questions and I'll give you some advice on how you can get on with your life. 
This is from Dirk Thrust from Warninglid. He says he has broken a leg. 
Well I would say that I'm not that kind of doctor. So I would have to recommend getting a crutch or walking stick. But hey, half price on shoes.]

Excellent. So what other questions have the Deep Doctor answered, what are some of the really tricky questions?	
jacob	Some of the tricky questions I don't really remember. But I remember one question was something related to medical qualification and I had a right old way because... 	
KIRUNA	Because you're not a real doctor. 	
jacob	Who needs qualifications these days anyway?	
KIRUNA	True. If you've got an opinion and you can share it, go for it. 	
rob	Can I ask you a question, Deep Doctor please?	
jacob	Yes sir. 	
rob	I'd like to know I'm visually impaired and it means that I'm really rubbish at football. How can I get better at football, playing football whilst still having such terrible eyesight? Any tips? 	
jacob	I don't really want to answer that because I like you. 	
rob	Pretend that you... Go on be the Deep Doctor tell me what you'd do if you really were being honest. 	
jacob	Well... 	
rob	Get into the role here, come on. 	
jacob	Alright. The Deep Doctor... right if you're physically impaired and can't play football you could either instead use something that makes sound like maybe a rolled up hedgehog. It might make a lot of sound. 	
rob	Yeah it would be quite noisy. 	
KIRUNA	Especially when you kick it. 	
rob	Yeah absolutely. 	
jacob 	Or maybe a sort of kicking bomb. 	
KIRUNA	Something that you can follow across the field. 	
rob	No it's very sensible. I can't believe it's taken me 32 years to actually think of that and you came up with it in ten seconds. I just need to play football with a bomb or a rolled up hedgehog. 	
jacob	Not very recommendable. 	
rob	No I can see there's health and safety issues. 	
jacob	Yeah. 	
KIRUNA	Now April's show that you guys did a little while ago looks amazing. You had music from bands from all other place, you had interviews you had April Fool pranks from artists with different learning disabilities, Zombie attacks in the studio and Luc spies something unusual in his binoculars - what did Luc see, I'm dying to know? 	
jacob	Well... 	
ryan	That's too disturbing!	
KIRUNA	What did he see?	
rob	Was it legal? 	
jacob	Okay, Luc, a fellow radio DJ who sadly could not be here for whatever reason, by the way, Luc, we sort of wish you were here. Okay, what Luc saw was through a window he saw an April shower as in April showering with a blue camel. 	
ryan	Of course.	
KIRUNA	He saw April showering... 	
jacob	April showers. 	
KIRUNA	... oh April... not April showering with a blue camel. 	
jacob	April showers. 	
rob	A girl called April.	
jacob	Showering with a blue camel. 	
KIRUNA	Who's April. 	
rob	Who's April? 	
ryan	It's a subtle pun. 	
jacob	It's a... 	
ryan	It's radio. 	
KIRUNA	I'm being a bit slow aren't I? 	
jacob	It's Sam's sister that's all we know.	
KIRUNA	April okay. 	
ryan	It's the joy of radio you can say anything you like. It may all all make sense…	
rob	We've been making absolutely so sense on this show for the last six years so... 	
KIRUNA	No. But I was convinced... 	
rob	... I see no problem with you doing the same thing. 	
KIRUNA	... that there was a camel hanging out with April and... 	
ryan	Yeah. 	
KIRUNA	... cleansing... 	
ryan	It's not really surprising considering the blue camel club is very close, Carousel's Club night that is. 	
KIRUNA	Ah okay. 	
rob	It's all starting to slot into place. And zombie attacks.	
KIRUNA	It's making so much sense to me now. 	
rob	Can you explain Zombie attacks in the studio?	
ryan	Yeah, there came a song zombie attack out of nowhere. Thankfully though two of the committee members, myself and Luc, that other guy you heard, are members of a heavy metal band at Carousel called Zombie Crash... 	
rob	You're fully trained in disposing of unwanted zombie attacks. 	
KIRUNA	Dealing with the undead. 	
ryan	Yeah. 	
rob	What are your methods? Can you go into that for us? 	
ryan 	Simple. Rip them apart by any means at our disposal. 	
KIRUNA	And I suppose that's a really good use for a double bass guitar?	
rob	Indeed as a weapon of mass destruction, of zombie destruction. 	
ryan	Yeah. Just remove the strings on the guitar and lacerate them with it. 	
KIRUNA	Oh a bit of garrotting. You've got to chop their heads off. That's the way I've been told to do it. 	
ryan	Do it with razor wire. 	
KIRUNA	Exactly.	
ryan	Maybe I should get a razorback guitar. 	
KIRUNA	Your style of music you're more into the heavy metal stuff. 	
ryan	Yeah I love metal and all of its sub-genres. 	
KIRUNA	What are the other bands that you also play on the radio, what kind of music do they do? 	
ryan	We play both well known and disabled artists as well as those who practically don't get up to much at all. We play... 	
jacob	Any genre will do. 	
ryan	Yeah any genre at all. 	
rob	Can you name check a few of your favourites for us or ones we should be looking out for...	
ryan	Yeah so far...	
rob	... on MySpace. 	
ryan	Yeah there are quite a few learning disabled artists who people should be keeping their eyes open for or ears open for that matter as well. Like Heavy Load.	
rob	 Oh yeah we know them well. 	
ryan	Yeah. 	
rob	Old friends of the show. 	
ryan	Yeah and they still go strongly as ever.	
rob	They've got a great song called Is Bruce Forsyth Dead which is one of my absolute favourites. Have you heard that one?	
ryan	Yes I have heard them I just wonder what Bruce Forsyth himself would think. 	
rob	Well one day, we need to send a tape. Who else? 	
ryan	There's also... 	
rob	Because they've been around for a few years. Is there any really newer ones you can think of? 	
ryan	Regarding newer bands, well new to us is an Australian rock band... 	
KIRUNA	Whoo-hoo! 	
ryan	... called Rudely Interrupted. 	
KIRUNA	I just had to cheer there for my countrymen. Sorry, Ryan continue. 	
ryan	Yeah. There's also Lizzie Emma who is a singer at Heart & Soul, another disabled arts organisation. 	
KIRUNA	And what about you, Jacob, have you got any favourites? 	
jacob	I don't have any specific favourite no I don't really. I like some bands. I like others who are very nice I do have some... I like some music. I don't like some other music.	
KIRUNA	Okay. So you've got a really broad spectrum of taste.	
rob	And what do people think of the show?	
ryan	They've responded to it very positively. They're always saying different things about it. There was even the time when our launch party was featured on BBC South East Today and right afterwards the presenters were just like, "Well that seems like a lot of fun. And what a title for a radio show." That's right, shut up and listen. 	
KIRUNA	It's a great title. 	
ryan	"Right, let's shut up and listen to the weather shall we?" 	
KIRUNA	Now how can people... 	
rob	What a link!	
KIRUNA	How can people actually shut up and listen to the show? 	
jacob	Well for one they could if they're in the Brighton area they could tune in on Radio Reverb 97.2FM on Thursdays at 8:00 o'clock; or they could go on line at www.shutupandlisten.org.uk and go to the radio section. You can also download iTunes... 	
KIRUNA	We'll put links up on our website to it as well, so that people can find it really easily. But it sounds like the work that you're doing is... it sounds like so much fun. 	
jacob	It does yeah. 	
KIRUNA	I mean even just reading the blurb about April's show I want to go back and I want to listen to it. It sounds just like an absolute blast. 	
rob	I want to know what a zombie attack on the radio actually sounds like. 	
KIRUNA	I wish someone would come in here and attack us. Nothing interesting happens in this studio. 	
rob	No we don't.	
KIRUNA	This ivory fortress. 	
jacob	I believe because you’ve got great funding it means you've got good security.	
rob	Not all that good.	
KIRUNA	Do you know what - our producer just offered to send an angry guide dog in.	
rob	Well thank you so much guys for coming in. And watch out for Damon's flatulent guide dog on the way out. 	
KIRUNA	Yeah hold your breath. 	
rob	Yeah hold your breath. Hold everything. 	
jacob	Hold your nose.	
ryan	What does he have bad breath so that when he barks at you? Talk about bark being worse than the bite. 	
jacob	No he has a farting problem, Ryan. Flatulence farting. 	
KIRUNA	Farting. 	
ryan	So he farts…..	
rob	It's different to halitosis.	
jacob	Hold your nose and run. Run!	
ryan	You've got the wrong end of the dog. 	
rob	And as Kiruna said we will put links up on the website and thank you so much for coming to join us today. 	
ryan	We don't advertise deodorant. 	
jacob	What?	
ryan	They said they're going to put Lynx up.	
jacob	Okay. 	
rob	Dreadful. 	
ryan	Hey we're the masters of comedy. 	
KIRUNA	Alright, out. Out of the studio. 	
rob	Shut up. 	
ryan	Okay. 	
jacob	Leg it. 	
ryan	Bye. 	
KIRUNA	Bye. See yer. Thanks for coming in. Ladies and gentlemen that was Shut Up and Listen.	
rob	And that's the end of the show. We'll be back in two weeks around the 24th May in a show featuring disabled reality TV star, Sophie Morgan, and music from the autastic Captain Angelo amongst other things.	
KIRUNA	Thanks to the team - Emma Tracey, Dan Slipper and studio manager Jill Drabble. The producer was Damon Rose. Goodbye! 	
rob	Bye!